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Rational Response Squad- opinions
Just wondered what people's opinions are of the Rational Respose Squad?

At first I quite liked their brashness, but now it seems that they are nothing more than spoilt brats. Instead of having a sensible discussion, they seem more intent on pushing their beliefs forcefully and making comments that ammount to "you're dumb you fucking dumbass dick for believing in God, fuck you".

And after the major contradictions in the whole Greydon Square case where the rapper beat the crap out of Brian Sapient (though some say it was just a slap) for reasons which seem very dodgy involving possible fraud on Sapients part* , I do wonder how trust worthy they are.

They seem to not represent Atheism in the same positive light as Dawkins, Hitchens or Randi who are logically able to refute claims without talking to people like they are unintelligent children (though Hitchens has his moments).

Basically, the whole group confuse me and I wonder if they are nothing more than a novelty. Even though they are public figures now, they insist on using stupid pseudonyms instead of names. If they wanted to remain annonymous fine, but the stage names aren't neccesary now they are public. Oh, and Kelly's voice REALLY pisses me off! just watch the debate between RRS and Ray Comfort/ Kirk Cameron on Youtube, I had to switch off.

Here's their site for those who are unaware.


Just wondered what peoples opinions were.

*(unfortunately I can't find a decent write up for this incident, but there's loads of biased stuff on the RRS website)
It's another one of those many things (like Christianity) that seemed a good idea at the time and was kicked off with the best of intentions only to be hijacked by jerks. I stopped checking in with them years ago. Isn't/wasn't there a member of who was active in the group? Neil
I personally think they fail, too sporradic in their arguments. But who am I to say what any other atheist should do apart from not believing (in gods for you fundie quote miners).

I read that Greydon Square was bipolar, but seriously I couldn't care less, sometimes people just deserve a punch. I dont know what happened, and there are much more troubling thjings going on, on a much larger scale.

We are not responsible for eachothers opinions, we can only confront those that are not founded in evidence. Let that bunch of people make asses out of themselves, reflects nothing on me.

That's a shame to hear. I guess being a rationalist is no guarantee of rational behavior
The RRS are scum of the Earth.

I used to like them and hung out in the Stickam room. I became pretty good online friends with Brian. After a while I started seeing things that I could not accept. There's a laundry list of unethical stuff they were doing, but one I got into a huge on air fight with him about concerned him cheating on his live in gf, (who fully supported him so he didn't have to work), with a 17 year old fan named Nikki. There's a long story which involves Brain talking Nikki into masturbating for the stickam audience. She had no cam at the time so it was audio only. I muted the crap and went back to editing some files. After the *episode* was over one of the guys in the stuckam room was griping at Brian in the text box. Once I saw that I knew the tacky episode was over so I unmuted and told Brian that what he was doing would be ammunition for Christians to use against Atheists, they'd paint us as pervs who are seducing young teens etc...we ended up in a huge fight. I went off on him about cheating on his gf, his excuses were typical of him, he claimed she was emotionally disturbed and frigid in bed, (he always blames everyone else and calls them mentally ill, it's the same shit he did with Greydon).

At the time of the Nikki episode, both she and Brian told me she was 17, some people now claim she was 18. I have no idea, I don't really care. Either way Brian is a sexual predator in my eyes and he manipulated a young girl into doing sexual favors for him. He's a pig.

Then there's the whole Rook's fraudulent credentials and the NYCA cult crap, go read that thread if you don't know what I'm talking about. There has been a lot of online controversy surrounding Rook's fake credentials.

Then there's the whole mail/wire fraud incident concerning Greydon's music. I spoke with Greydon over the phone about it and quite honestly, I think Brian deserved getting his ass kicked. Greydon could have been charged with fraud, it was his name and reputation being ruined. He had every right to confront Brian and the only reason things came down to fist-a-cuffs was Brian's arrogant and uncaring attitude. Yes, Greydon lost it, and yes, I can understand exactly how that kind of thing could happen. If you put Brian and I in the same room I'd most likely end up beating the crap out of him too.

In my opinion, the RRS is a cult. I consider them an embarrassment to all Atheists and I wish they would disappear.
Well there we go, learn something new every day. Personally I would like myself a nice teen gf now (im only 21) but not as low as 17, theres a rule of thumb. Half your age and add seven. Maybe 18 is too low now.

Now, coercing a girl into masturbating for an audience I do not agree with. Especially since it was a public channel.

I am always a bit suspicious of people who get battered and then make out that they are not offended, but are sorry for the person, because a normal reaction is to hate that person, or to have fought back.
Rayven, I didn't know all that about the young girl. Sapient strikes me as a real dick, from some of the Youtube postings on Greydon's vids it seems that a large number of Atheists are opposed to the RRS and that Sapient certainly deserved the ass kicking (if indeed it was an ass kicking and not a slap as some claim).

I like Greydon's music, I think he's a very important name, much more than the RRS as he has a chance to reach a larger audience and he should be supported. his mental conditions, wether true or not, should not be used as an attack against him or to defend RRS and make them look better. Many great people in the public eye are bi-polar. Stephen Fry, one of Britains greatest names- rationalist, intelligent, respected tv actor, writer and presenter- has been bi-polar his entire life.

I found the whole RRS Vs. Cameron/ Comfort thing on nightline a bit of a joke, which could have been handled much better.
Nikki isn't exactly the pure and naive type, but I still think Brian used and manipulated her. She fawned all over him because she wanted to be in the spotlight, she wanted to be the *star's girlfriend*, a groopy kind of thing, and he took full advantage of that. He has a knack for taking advantage of women. I think being a con-artist is his only real talent, although he's not all that good at that either. He had to go out and get a real job recently. LOL!!! It seems their 15 minutes is over.

In my opinion, they were not chosen by the media to do those *debates* because they have talent and/or brains, they were chosen because they make Atheists look bad. There are plenty of brilliant Atheists who could have been chosen but the media chose the loser and the stripper. There was a reason for that, and it wasn't a good one.
The Rational Response Squad is simply the cult of Brian Cutler with Kelly O'Connor as the tits and Rook Hawkins as the psuedo-intellectual blather.

In the first chapter of the first book of Sapient it reads:

"Gather unto the interwebs retards, gimps, and neck-beards. Let this be known as Rational. Blather unto the masses for God is not present. Amen."

The RRS are an atheist church just a tad bit worse at it than American Atheists.
Over the years I've spent time checking out the RRS, to see what people there have to say, check out their videos, etc.

Over all I knew from the start it wasn't a place where I wanted to spend my time regularly, or frequently. There's a huge difference between diverse, outspoken, forthright, tell-it-like-it-is, give it to you straight people and a bunch of rude, 'loud' mouthed, obnoxious, attention-needy bores, all in one place. Hitchens' version of being forthright at least carries some kind of meaning and message (not to mention entertainment!) - the posturing version of rude, mouthiness I've seen so much of at RRS is too time consumming to wade through to find much else, although of course, like any other group of people there are some who aren't that way. Still, in general, I just never found the Brian and Kelly show to be worth much, or even entertaining, to me.

I read a good bit that was written about the Sapient/Square ordeal on the site. I really don't know much about it at all, and MO is that the whole thing is so unfortunate, for Greydon. He's very talented, and I hope he'll get whatever his problems may be resolved soon and keep his career on track.

Rathpig wrote:
Rook Hawkins as the psuedo-intellectual blather.

I haven't seen much from the other guys but I've read a couple of things by Rook Hawkins. This is an apt description.
seeker wrote:
Rathpig wrote:
Rook Hawkins as the psuedo-intellectual blather.

I haven't seen much from the other guys but I've read a couple of things by Rook Hawkins. This is an apt description.

The real shame is that he could obtain an education and actually put his passion to work. Few people have the passion to research and write in the field of his interest, but he fails to grasp that it requires a very systematic education to do this correctly. He can't teach himself to be a Historian, and his flailing at poser is sad.

There are very long threads at both and which take poor Rook to task.
Oh yes, Rook has been torn to shreds over at Dawkin's site and at RnR.

I do think it's a shame that he won't go to college and get an actual degree. He could actually do well in the field if he'd get a real education.
I remember when Brian and Rook were thinking up the whole RRS thing over at the AN. The original idea was to create an organization which was to act as an answer to all those pesky evangelical communities brazenly shoving God down everyone's throat. At first, they were doing good.

However, it seems some where along the way they seem to have lost perspective. I do know that the community does have some very intelligent and well meaning atheists there, some of whom are bothered by the progressively sensational tactics employed by the RRS founders.

I haven't kept up with the RRS and had no idea about the incident with Brian and Greydon nor the falsification of credentials by Rook. I do know that Rook is pretty knowledgable in respects to much theology but falsification of credentials is dishonest and something many creationists had a habit of doing.

I'm a more attracted to organizations that are more professional like Shermer's Skeptic Society and the Center for Inuiry. However, some sensationalism is bad if used in a particular way such as how Penn and Teller do on their show.
Edited by Solidsquid on 10/09/2008 21:27
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